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Mary Magdaline
Discussion
By WolfSpirit
Mary Magdalene Digital facial
reconstruction
Hey I have just finished reading
the Da Vinci Code (which professes that Jesus was married to
Mary Magdelene, who was not a prostitute but a woman of noble
birth) and I was writing some notes tonight, when something
made me go and want to check if a supposition in the book, that
Mary Magdelene is in Da Vinci's picture, "The Last Supper",
was true. So I grabbed one of my old history of art textbooks
to see if the Last Supper was in there. Being just about one
of the worlds most talked about pictures, it sure was: in an
extendable three page pull out. And yes, it is pretty clear
that the figure on Jesus's right looks very feminine! Decidedly
so! So I decided to read the commentary to the picture, which
tells us that the picture depicts Jesus with the apostles, and
that St John was seated to the right of Jesus...huh???
E. H. Gombrich "The Story of
Art" is one of the biggest selling, most critically acclaimed,
art history books ever written. How on earth could they not
spot that St John is depicted as a woman (either that or a very
feminine man! Hmm! Ok, if i remember rightly Da Vinci was gay,
and a bit of an anti-authority figure, but I don't think even
he would have gotten away in the 1500/1600's with portraying
Jesus as a gay man! )
The bible tells us in John XIII
23-4 "Now there was leaning on Jesus' bosom one of his
disciples, whom Jesus loved". What is going on here????
Now this really got me thinking! You ask any cleric which Gospel
they consider the most revealing and the chances are that they
will tell you John.
Who is more likely to know a man
but his wife..... So all you Mary Magdelene aficionado’s
out there....was St John really Mary Magdelene? Is this a common
assertion? (Oh, and on a deeper inspection, the figure looks
decidedly similar to the figure in Mona Lisa!)
ShaeTheFireWitch:
Hi Wolfie-
To answer your
question, Mary Magdalene is not St. John. It is the Gospel of
St. John that he (John) describes Mary Magdaelene and her encounter
with Jesus at the last supper and how she anointed his feet
with a salve from her alabaster jar. This is Mary Magdelene.
It is Mary Magdalene who, according to all the Evangelists,
stood at the foot of the cross and assisted at the entombment
and was the first recorded witness of the Resurrection. And
while St. John calls her "Mary Magdalen" in 19:25,
20:1, and 20:18, he calls her simply "Mary" in 20:11
and 20:16.
In the Gospels
of Matthew and Mark, along with the Gospel of John they speak
of Mary Magdalene as "Mary of Bethany". Liturgy scholars
have determined that this person is indeed Mary Magdalene.
The Gnostic "Gospel
of Philip" mentions Mary Magdalene as the "consort"
of Jesus, one of the women who was his constant companion. The
evidence that Mary Magdalene and Jesus together provided the
model for the "hieros gamos" (Sacred Marriage) in
Christianity is found in the Gospels themselves. The numbers
coded by gem atria in her name indicate that Mary Magdalene
was the "Goddess" among early Christians.
"The Gospels
of Mary" by Marvin Meyer explore Mary Magdalene and who
she was as a woman.
The Gnostic Gospels
are a wonderful resource to see MM in biblical text. "The
Gospel of Mary Magdalene" is also a great book to explore
for further interest in the Magdalene, and to delve into the
women who followed and actually read her words of the accounting
she has of her time with Jesus and her own life story. There
are several articles that have come out over the years that
suggest Mary Magdalene is the author of the Fourth Gospel.
www.magdalene.org/fourthgospel.htm
Many books have
been published by Margaret Starbird about Mary Magdalene. She
has published several interesting articles on the recent influx
of Magdelene energies that are charging across the Earth Some
thought on 9/11 and Mary Magdalene and their correlations -
www.magdalene.org/twintowers.htm
I have lots more information on Mary Magdalene as you can tell.
Hope this answers your questions and then some.
Mouse:
Wolfie,
you've already heard my recommendation for "The Bloodline
of the Holy Grail" by Sir Lawrence Gardner - and I will
add it here again.
WolfSpirit:
Shae, Thanks for your reply
and for the information, if it's OK, I have a few questions...
Why do you think that MM is not the
author of St John's gospel? Is there any evidence that says
she most definitely was not? And do you think that, although
she may not have actually physically written the gospel, that
she was the apostle who's story is written by John in St John's
gospel, i.e. was she was the Beloved apostle? Finally, is MM
a central figure in goddess worship or does the Goddess purely
relate to pre-Christian Goddesses or is this a matter of choice?
ShaeTheFireWitch:
“Why
do you think that MM is not the author of St John's gospel?
Is there any evidence that says she most definitely was not?
And do you think that, although she may not have actually physically
written the gospel, that she was the apostle who's story is
written by John in St John's gospel, i.e. was she was the Beloved
apostle?”
Actually Wolfie,
I do believe She is the author of the Gospel of St. John. I've
done much research on this and have worked very heavily with
the Nag Hammadi and the Gnostic Scriptures. There is a large
amount of evidence which supports this theory. If she did not
write it, the Gospel from a theological standpoint, and a metaphysical
standpoint indicate that MM was the "Beloved Apostle"
written in the Gospel of St. John. I didn't express my opinion
because I was trying to be unbiased...LOL
“Finally,
is MM a central figure in goddess worship or does the Goddess
purely relate to pre-Christian Goddesses or is this a matter
of choice?”
It is a matter
of personal choice. MM is not a central figure in Goddess worship
that I know of, and the Goddess does not purely relate in my
view to pre-Christian times. Many people recognize the Goddess
as the feminine face of God, The Divine Feminine. They call
Her by many names and She shows up in many faces. In the Jewish
Tradition, the Divine Feminine shows up as the Shehkina (the
Dove). In Christianity, the Holy Spirit is consider the Christian
aspect of the Feminine, along with the Virgin Mary. Before Christianity
was born, people referred to the Earth as "The Mother"
and they worshipped Her and Her cycles. In Egyptian traditions,
the Feminine is expressed as Isis, Hathor and Sekhmet. In the
Yoruban and African traditions, The Divine Feminine is expressed
in the faces of Oya, Oshun, Yemaya and Ogun. In the Mayan tradition,
IxChel is another example of their version of the Divine Feminine.
It is documented many people in Judea considered Mary Magdalene
the living eartly incarnation of the Goddess. She was a temple
priestess and the priestess archetype is you are the sacred
Chalice, representing the Goddess in human form.
Ancient history
shows us time and again in pre-Christian societies that worship
of the Feminine was prevalent in many cultures and Priests and
Priestesses of the Feminine were people of tremendous power
and position. Just some examples for you. They don't call her
the Goddess of 10,000 Faces for nothing...LOL Many of the new
mystical Christian traditions and Gnostics work with MM. My
connection with MM started back in my childhood. I was raised
Roman Catholic and always felt a strong affinity with Her. As
I grew older and began my theological studies, I became fascinated
with her and came to a deeper understanding of who She represents
in the world. My own priestess lineage comes from Mary Magdalene.
In my training as a Priestess and a High Priestess, we explored
the mysteries and archetypes that MM represents in our culture.
I am a Magdalene High Priestess, as befits from my tradition
and priestess lineage.
Hope this helps
answer your questions. Ask anything you like, will be happy
to answer...
Have you ever
heard of the Knights Templar? If you read the Davinci Code,
you know what I am talking about. There is a lot of information
on this group and it's legends that are really interesting to
look into and dig deeper. In France, there is a chapel to Mary
Magdalene. Off the top of my head I can't think of it. But,
it is rumored and believed that the Holy Grail was once stored
there. Just adding more silk to the web- so to speak on the
legend of MM.
RavenStarr:
Shae,
Thanks so much for those links. Definitly some good points there
. More food for thought. I just love that . Thanks!!
WolfSpirit:
Hey Mouse, Thanks for the
reminder!
Shae, Wow! Thanks for all the info!
This will give me something to chew on for a while
I was just sat here last night writing
about something completely different and I started writing about
MM! and then I felt I had to go and do look up the reference
to the picture in the Da Vinci Code. But this wasn't a "I
wonder" sort of moment this was almost a compulsion! And
when I read the stuff in the art book, I was told that MM wrote
St John's Gospel, and I knew that a few people here had mentioned
MM in the past, so naturally I had to come check this out!
I knew about the Earth being a feminine
principal, and I knew that there were many feminine Goddesses
from various different cultures prior to Christianity (although
I did not know all the names), and from the Da Vinci code I
read a lot about the demonization of the feminine...but I feel
that there is a lot to learn about from your post. Where this
is all going, I don't know, but I am sure that I will be coming
back to this over the coming months!
I know this all ties in somehow with
my old Fourth Age thread and possibly my Third Gender thread:
the stuff I was looking at before I went to Scotland. But right
now I am off to finish reading the links you put up, so I dare
say that I shall be back later! Thanks again Shae.
Unregistered Guest:
Thanks Wolf and Shae, it's
been really interesting to read this thread. I wanted to ask
these types of questions myself in the Da Vinci Code thread.
Due to the amount of time I have here, I've not been able to
get involved with the Mary Magdalene issue which I find fascinating,
and wonder why on earth I've not come across this before! That
is a wonder in itself LOL.
I've added the book you mentioned
to my wish list Mouse and thanks for that, I know you'd mentioned
it in the other thread.
Shae:
fantastic to read
and like Wolf I think there'll be more questions and discussions
in the future.
Wolf:
I think
that's what I truly enjoyed about the Da Vinci Code. As you
said in the other forum it's not a great literary work yet it
provokes thought, and made me inquisitive to find out more about
Mary Magdalene. Like I just said, I'm astounded not to have
come across it before. I've got some reading to do that's for
certain LOL
Any more
posts on Mary Magdalene will be very much appreciated and enjoyed!
StarDreamer:
While I haven't
read DaVinci Code...I've ordered it twice and both times the
order got cancelled! ...I have read some other novels that deal
with MM or the Grail/Templars.
Moon Under Her Feet by Kinstler...a
good story woven around MM speculation based on history. Gives
you much to think about.
The Archer series of books
by Bernard Cornwall. I love his stuff. Great reads. These deal
with speculation around the Holy Grail/Templars. He also has
a series re King Arthur that's worth reading and one on Stonehenge.
Good storytelling based in history.
I've also tried to wade through
Holy Blood, Holy Grail by Baigent, Leigh and Lincoln. It's not
easy reading, but this one is a must for Grail lore, Roslyn
Chapel, etc.
WolfSpirit:
Stardreamer, “He also
has a series re King Arthur that's worth reading and one on
Stonehenge.”Do you know any the titles of any of these?
StarDreamer:
The Arthur Books
The Winter King
Enemy of God
Excalibur
The Stonehenge book is just
titled Stonehenge
The Grail Quest Harlequin
(UK title)/
The Archer's Tale (US title)
Vagabond Heretic
ShaeTheFireWitch:
I am
doing some research on the Black Madonna/Mary Magdalene correlation.
I have numerous articles and books I have gathered over the
last few months. I found this great link this morning online
and it discusses the correlation between the Black Madonnas/Black
Virgins and Mary Magdalene and how they have always been associated
with MM and the Goddess. Mary Magdalene Article From what it
looks like there is also a documentary you can view online.
WolfSpirit:
Thanks for the link...a
very interesting site all round!
StarDreamer:
Fascinating stuff,
Shae! Thanks for the link!
Marila:
A very
good book with many, many details and information is: China
Galland: "Longing for Darkness. Tara and the Black Madonna"
It describes the journey of a woman (a true story!) to find
what Tara and the Black Madonna means - and she really visited
over years, years, years the places all over the world, got
deep insight... This journey became her own life journey, too...It
is a true story - and a really interesting book. Lots of information.
Also how the Black Madonnas are connected...
ScubaGrrl:
Fascinating.
Thank you, Shae.
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Libraries
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INDEX
Page 3
(Main Section, Medicine Wheel, Native Languages &
Nations, Symbology)
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INDEX
Page 5
(Sacred Feminine & Masculine, Stones & Minerals)
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